"for conscience' sake

Is the ce' in "for conscience' sake" pronounced as /iz/? Even though there isn't 's.
The 's is pronounced as /iz/ after sibilants (s, z, sh, and zh ch) but isn't the pronunciation the same in my example too?
The example is from The Oxford Guide to Style by R. M. Ritter.

I pronounce it more like a "s" than a "z".

Anna232 said:

Is the ce' in "for conscience' sake" pronounced as /iz/? Even though there isn't 's.

Click to expand...

ce is almost aways pronounced /s/

Anna232 said:

The 's is pronounced as /iz/ after sibilants (s, z, sh, and zh ch)

Click to expand...

No. The -es is pronounced /ɪz/

Anna232 said:

but isn't the pronunciation the same in my example too?

Click to expand...

No. The apostrophe comes after the s. The e is not pronounced.

5jj said:

ce is almost aways pronounced /s/

No. The -es is pronounced /ɪz/

No. The apostrophe comes after the s. The e is not pronounced.

Click to expand...

Is conscience' sake pronounced as /konsaiensiz/?

Anna232 said:

Is conscience' sake pronounced as /konsaiensiz/?

Click to expand...

/ˈkɒnʃənsseɪk/

5jj said:

/ˈkɒnʃənsseɪk/

Click to expand...

I am lost. If s is a sibilant and c in conscience is pronounced as s, then why isn't the final part pronounced as iz?

Anna232 said:

I am lost. ...

Click to expand...

Don't be. Your expectation is correct. If this was written "for conscience's sake", the ending would be /...siz/; but by convention (to avoid all those sibilants) the final "s" is omitted, leaving the phonemic transcription given by @5jj.

Anna232 said:

I am lost. If s is a sibilant and c in conscience is pronounced as s, then why isn't the final part pronounced as iz?

Click to expand...

I don't understand. How could it be pronounced two different ways?

Pronounced in full, it would be "conscience's" (ends with an -iz sound) followed by "sake" as a separate word. Only someone who is (rather unnaturally) enunciating every syllable would say it that way. Native speakers run the words together and, as a result, the sound of the "e" is lost and the two "s"s run together in a single "s" sound. It sounds like "consciensake". The whole "e's" sound is lost, hence the loss of the "iz" sound.

The sound of the "e"? I pronounce it con-shuns. There is no "e" sound.

Tarheel said:

The sound of the "e"? I pronounce it con-shuns. There is no "e" sound.

Click to expand...

In "conscience's" (ie "of conscience") the "e" would be pronounced. The phrase in post #1 is "for conscience' sake", in which the "s" after the apostrophe has been omitted but it's still a possessive apostrophe. In full, as I already explained, that phrase would be "for conscience's sake". However, when written, we often omit the "s" and when spoken, we behave as if the "e's" isn't even there.

Tarheel said:

I don't understand. How could it be pronounced two different ways?

Click to expand...

Can you imagine what we non-native speakers have to go through while learning English?

emsr2d2 said:

In "conscience's" (ie "of conscience") the "e" would be pronounced. The phrase in post #1 is "for conscience' sake", in which the "s" after the apostrophe has been omitted but it's still a possessive apostrophe. In full, as I already explained, that phrase would be "for conscience's sake". However, when written, we often omit the "s" and when spoken, we behave as if the "e's" isn't even there.

Click to expand...

I thought the 's or s' are pronounced in the same way, aren't they? For example, Dickens' or Dickens's, James's or James', Charles' or Charles's Jesus's and Jesus'. Am I wrong?

Let's take "James". Spelled "James'" I would pronounce it the same as without the apostrophe. However, spelled "James's" I would pronounce the additional syllable as indicated.

Tarheel said:

Let's take "James". Spelled "James'" I would pronounce it the same as without the apostrophe. However, spelled "James's" I would pronounce the additional syllable as indicated.

Click to expand...

Do you mean the 's in James's is pronounced as /iz/ but James and James' are pronounced in the same way?

Yes, I guess that's what I mean. With the one (James's) there's a difference in both writing and speech. With the other one (James') the only difference is in writing.